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35000 Watts Podast – S3E3 – Charles Driebe (110 downloads )TRANSCRIPT
Hello and welcome back to 35,000 Watts, the podcast. It’s the spinoff of 35,000 watts. The story of college radio, a documentary about college radio, available now on Amazon Prime, Google Play, Tubi, and now full version is also available on YouTube, so you can go and check that out right now.
Today, where our host Lisa is going to be talking to another college radio alumni from WTUL in New Orleans. Well, today’s special guest is Charles Dreby. And you come to us from WTUL.
Tell us where you started. Like, how did you find what college you were going to go to and what led you into radio and all that? Well, I graduated from high school in 1974.
And in those days, it was not easy to figure out a lot of information about colleges. You don’t have the wealth of information that you have today. You basically had a fat book that had one page on every college.
But I did visit a couple of colleges and as one could expect an 18 year old going to New Orleans, Louisiana for the 1st time was pretty exciting. And so I decided to go to Tulane University. And where did you grow up?
I grew up in Atlanta, Georgia, and actually, as I was growing up in my high school years, I was a big fan of WREK, which was the Georgia Tech radio station, and also WRAS, which was the Georgia State radio station. They both had good power. So you got their signal all over the city.
WRAS was more new music focused, and WREK was more eclectic. They would play everything from symphonic music to bluegrass, to John Cage, to jazz, really wide range of music, which, to me, always seemed like, well, I guess because of that early experience. I felt like, oh, that’s what college radio does.
They just play everything. And so I really did love WREK and it really did expand my musical horizons. I decided to go to Tulane University.
I got there and I said, I want to be on the radio station. Uh, that was WTUL 91.5 At that time, they were 10 watts, but New Orleans is a very flat place, and their transmitter was on top of one of the tallest buildings in uptown New Orleans, which was one of the dormitories. So the 10 lots did pretty good uh, as far as getting the signal out uh, later during my time at Tulane in 1976.
The power was increased to 1500 watts, which basically covered the whole city really well. And that was through a congressperson, Lindy Boggs, who was elected to Congress in 73 after her husband died in a plane crash, and she was a Tulane graduation, graduate. Actually, she went to Newcomb College, which was the women’s college for Tulane, and, of course, they emerge now.
But anyway, she was an alarm. And she helped get this power increase in in 76. Why do you think she was a part of that?
I think she just was a supporter of Tulane anyway, she could be, and I’m not clear on who got that request into her or how she learned about it, but, you know, at that time, the FCC was a lot more involved, and there was much more oversight of radio stations. And uh, we, of course, had to get engineers licenses, like the DJs had to get engineers licenses and that sort of thing that were all issued by the FCC. So that was one of the hurdles to being on the air back in those days is you had to, you had to get that license.
And, you know, some people that were sort of casual would that would weed them out. But I wasn’t casual. I really wanted to, uh, be on the radio mostly just because I really loved music.
So I got a jazz show. I was into all kinds of music, but I did love jazz, and so I got a jazz show, and that morphed into a couple of days a week, and the jazz show was called the World of Jazz. Uh, that was named before I got there.
It was from 4 to 7 pm, which, of course, is, you know, prime drive time. People going home, cooking dinner, that sort of thing. So, the jazz show had a pretty decent reach.
We eventually, uh, when I got there was 5 days a week and eventually ended up at 7 days a week. one of our more popular shows. eventually did other shows as well, mostly rock shows. Of course, we had specialty shows, Broadway, oldies, uh, symphonic, that sort of thing. Uh, I actually was uh, in New Orleans just last week and and I had dinner with the guy who did the oldies show.
Alan Mason. His parents ran a record store in New Orleans, so he had an unbelievable collection of records and, you know, at that time we were actually spinning vinyl. We did have carts for public service announcements and such, but all the music was played on vinyl.
Good friend to have. So yes, he had he had an amazing collection. Unfortunately, he lost a lot of it in Katrina, but he’s still kicking around and still, uh, a music uh, aficionada.
So you had this jazz show and you’re in the jazz capital of the United States. How did that come about? And were you the only one in town?
I mean, there had to have been other people playing jazz on the radio. At the time, uh, incredibly. There weren’t other stations playing jazz music.
Uh, there was a public radio station that occasionally had some jazz programming from PBS or NPR or something like that. But as far as playing jazz and we covered everything from early jazz to contemporary jazz. And so there really wasn’t anyone else doing that.
Today, there is a great radio station in New Orleans, WWOZ, which is a community station which plays all kinds of New Orleans music, roots music, Louisiana music. They’re a really great station, and they have a great online presence. So that’s something worth checking out.
But at the time, there was no other station playing jazz. So we kind of owned that universe, then when I guess it was my, maybe my sophomore year, uh, a young woman, Rosie Wilson, opened a club, she had inherited some money, she opened a jazz club in the 70s. We were really kind of before the appreciation of local music, I guess you could say, artists who were kind of revered today were just working artists at that time.
Uh, I mean, we had the Neville brothers as at school dances at Tulane and guy, Professor Longhair, whose bust is at Tipatina’s club in New Orleans and who is sort of the patron saint of the New Orleans jazz fest. He was just playing around bars in town. So, it it really wasn’t appreciated, uh, the way it is today.
This young woman, uh, Rosie Wilson spent a lot of money opening this jazz club. She had artwork in there by Andy Warhol and Robert Rauschenberg. She had Nakamichi tape decks, which were state of the art, and she had huge jazz names coming in there like Art Blakey, Ron Carter, Dizzy Gillespie.
All of whom we were the only outlet for. And so we ended up establishing a connection with the Rosie’s club, and they would bring us real-to-reel tapes, each week of whatever artist they had had in recently, and we would play those, and we would promo any upcoming shows for Rosie’s, since we were the only game in town. Uh, we were able to make that connection and I am, you know, 19, 20 years old.
I’m on the permanent guest list at Rosie’s. They comp my bar tab. So I’m in there ordering drinks and food and whatever, and you know, I’ll leave a tip, but I didn’t pay anything to do all that, which, you know, maybe one of the reasons the club eventually went out of business.
But, uh, it was good for a, for a young college student. I’ll tell you that. Yeah.
So it sounds like, you know, you partnered with someone in your community and it turned into this amazing opportunity for your college radio station to build the jazz community, to what it is and how we know New Orleans jazz today. I mean, you were an integral part in that, and not only were you playing these artists on the air, but you were like supporting the club and the nightlife, and it was like this great symbiotic relationship. Well, yeah, I mean, you know, New Orleans has the history of the foundation of jazz, which I think is very well appreciated today.
But like I said, we were kind of in a cultural lull at that time and there just wasn’t as much appreciation. I, I thank Rosie for bringing, you know, that, uh, really, most of her acts were more in the contemporary jazz mold. And they were national acts for the most part.
After I had been doing the jazz. program for a couple of years, I became the jazz program director, mostly because the program director, did not really know anything about jazz and didn’t want to schedule the DJs. So, the jazz program director. I would schedule the shows for the week.
As I mentioned, we got to 7 days a week, so we had to fill 7 shows a week. And also kind of oversaw somewhat the music that was being played. I mean, we wanted it to be, uh, real, so to speak, not totally commercial.
So that was another part, another aspect of being that, uh, jazz program director, but then my senior year, I became the station program director. Uh, and as you know, that just involves, Setting up the various shows on the schedule and having the DJs who fill those shows, and, um, You know, it’s a lot of organizational stuff, which serve me eventually well in my, uh, in my other careers. But, uh, the best thing about it was, I got a parking spot that said WTUL program director on it.
It was right next to the university center. Parking on the 2 lane campus was Difficult then, it’s even more difficult now. But that was the best perk of all, uh, was, uh, a parking space and, uh, I had thought I had died and gone to heaven between that and running a tab at Rosie’s.
Uh, it was a pretty good life for a young guy. Before I leave WTUL, I did want to say that I watched the movie, the 35000 Watts movie, which was great, and which there were so many things in there that I’m like, 0 yeah, that happened. Oh yeah, we did that.
It just really brought a lot of things back to mind. Um, one thing was smoking weed, uh, which was quite prevalent at that time. I think somebody in the movie mentioned putting on a really long song and, you know, going out to smoke a joint or whatever, which is something we did.
And occasionally we would smoke in the studio because we were like a lot of stations in the basement of the university center. Uh, and we were pretty tucked away and nobody really ever came in there. So one day I’m in there with my buddy and we had smoked some.
So we’re sitting in the studio. We get a knock at the door and it’s a campus tour leader and they’re, they have a group of parents and and potential students that they’re, they wanted to show the radio station to. So they come in and it was a little awkward, like, oh, this is our radio station, and here’s our DJ, you know, and the kids were probably going, hey, I think I’ll come to that school, you know, so.
Maybe it worked out okay. I don’t know. But another thing that I wanted to say about WTL before we left that topic.
Tulane had no music business program. There was no. I mean, very few schools did at that time, but there was no way to study anything about this or learn anything about this other than just playing music on the radio.
But we had so many WTUL and Tulane alums that went on to work in either radio or music or both. Just while I was there. There was a guy, Michael Reinert, who ended up being an attorney for Motown Universal Records.
There was a woman, Kathy Fishman, who did news, who ended up morning drive time show in Atlanta on WSB, which is, was a like a 50,000 watt station. You know, I ended up in the music business, which we can talk about later. The guys from the band Galactic went to Tulane.
The guys who founded the company Superfly, which put on Bonnaroo and Outside Lands Festival. They went to Tulane. I mean, the list goes on and on.
There’s a music supervisor in LA. Well, he’s now moved to New Orleans, back to New Orleans, Jonathan McHugh. He’s now teaching at Loyola University, which is next to Tulane.
So all of those people, you know, went to Lane, uh, or worked at WTL or both, and there was no training to do what they’re doing, they just ended up doing what they’re doing. And hopefully, and I think in most cases, from what I know, the same reason I’m doing what I do, just because they liked it. They loved it and they wanted to work in that thing that they were doing, you know, continue that on.
Uh, in my personal case, I realized uh, at that time that radio was becoming more corporate. And so like the idea of a DJ playing the music they liked, which is, you know, what the basis of college radio is, really wasn’t happening or was diminishing in the commercial world. So I was like, well, I really love music, I love radio, but I can’t see that being a career.
I don’t want to be, you know, like your typical AM radio DJ playing what they tell me to play. So you did your time at WTTUL. You, you know, established this great community connection.
You had this amazing scene popping up. You were in the clubs, you were promoting artists. So what came after that?
What happened next? So I decided to go to law school. Which may be the last refuge of scoundrels.
That’s a good way to not decide anything and not actually go get a job. But that’s what I decided to do. I spent a year in Washington, DC working and then I, Landed in Athens, Georgia.
To go to the University of Georgia School of Law in 1979. Which was a really good place and time to be in Athens, Georgia. The B 52s had already blown up and had moved to New York.
Uh, but there were a lot of other bands playing around town. There were a lot of clubs. And, uh, we did have some touring acts coming through town.
And actually on my 1st day of law school, which was the orientation day. I had gone out to a show the night before of John Cale, former member of the Velvet Underground, and he has been through a lot of, uh, phases in his music career. And in this particular phase, it was really loud.
Even at that young age, it was too loud for me, so I was taking a napkin and rolling it up and putting it in my ear to use sort of as an earplug. So I did that that night when I got home, I could not get one of them out of one of my ears. And so the next morning, I went to the law school orientation, but I really couldn’t hear well, and I was really bothered by this thing in my ear, so I ended up missing the law school orientation while I went to the infirmary and had them dig this out of my ear.
But that’s how much I love music. And so, uh, I had my priorities straight even then. And then in law school, I worked at WUOG, which was the radio station at University of Georgia, mostly I did rock there.
They didn’t really have a jazz show, at least not rock. that I uh, could do. And I had different hours there. But yes, I think in the movie, your documentary.
Uh, there was talking about WUOG being way up at the top of this, uh, student center. And, uh, it was many steps to get up there. But once you were up there, you were pretty much left alone.
So we managed to get out on the roof a few times and smoke some weed and uh, look at the stars uh, in between cuts. WOG was a great experience. So one of the, you know, hallmarks of college radio is supporting the local music scene.
I mean, you obviously already established that at Tulane with the Rosies and your jazz show and everything. So did you take that with you when you went to, um, you know, UOG and you were on air at UOG, what did you do to support local music and local bands in that area? Well, I didn’t take it with me so much as it was there.
I showed up at the same time that the Athens music scene was really popping off. And uh, there was a bunch of great bands playing around town. It was really cheap to live there.
It was cheap to go see these bands. Pylon was one of the bands. I went to a party one night at an old church.
It had been decommissioned and I think somebody like lived there now, some students. And there was a band playing and they played like 5 or 6 songs and everybody loved it and they said, play some more songs and they’re like, well, that’s all the songs we know. So they ended up playing one of or one or 2 of the songs again, like the 2nd time because that was the only songs they knew, and that band was REM, and that was their 1st gig, which that has been documented that that church gig was was their 1st gig.
But they definitely struck a chord with people, uh, right then and there. And and I also remember that one of the songs was, uh, a monkey’s song. I think it might have been, uh, last train to Clarksdale or not your stepping stone.
I can’t remember exactly which song it was. Maybe it’s documented somewhere, but anyway, I was at the 1st REM show. One of the guys, Peter Buck worked at Wuck Street Records, which was a record store in town, met him through some friends.
One thing led to another. And I got them a gig in Atlanta. It was their 1st gig ever in Atlanta.
It was at a club that didn’t last long, but at least they got a toehole there. And then I got him a gig at, uh, my, a place that my friend had some involvement with. It was a club called Hedgins, and it was in the Buckhead neighborhood of Atlanta. and they ended up doing that club a lot. uh, before they graduated to the 688 club, the 688 club was the, you know, the kind of the new wave, punk new music club in Atlanta, and it’s kind of legendary.
It was, I believe, the summer of 1980, and I think REM had a single out, but I don’t think they did not have an album out yet. And I got him this gig at this club, the one I mentioned hedgins in Buckhead. We rented a U-Haul to carry the band’s equipment over.
I was driving in this big car that my grandmother had given me, uh, Buick. And we were pulling the U-Haul behind it. And it was July, so it was hot as could be.
And this car had electric windows. So we’re driving down the road with the air conditioning on and Michael Stipe rolled down the window. And it just this flood of humidity came in like a sauna.
So I said, hey, hey, Michael, do you want the window down? He goes, yeah. and I said, tough luck? And I rolled it back up and locked the window.
REM’s manager, Burtis Downs, who was also in law school, ahead of me. Uh, he loves that story. He, he, he, the last time I saw him, he told me the story.
I say, Bert, I, Burtis, I know the story. I told you the story. I, I was the one who lived the story.
I was driving the car I was the one driving the car. Anyway, yes, it was great to see those guys go from, you know, the 1st gig at the church. I saw many, many times at the 40 watt club in Athens, which there’s been 340 watts, but I saw them in the 1st 240 watts.
The 3rd one is still there in Athens, and I remember another thing about them. Uh, and and this kind of gets back to the love of music. I mean, they just loved to play, and they played at a club called Tyrone’s.
They sold it out every time they played. And, you know, with my business, music business manager mind, I said, well, look, you guys are selling out this club and you’re charging a dollar. I said, if you charge $2, you make twice as much money and you’ll still sell it out.
And they said, yeah, but you know, a lot of our friends, about a dollar is about all they can afford. So we’re just going to keep it at a dollar. And I totally respect that, you know, that, I think that’s been that, that was their ethos the whole way through their career.
They never did something for money. Uh, they were more about music and, uh, and that’s sort of been my, uh, career arc as well. I mean I did all of this.
I did radio in college, helping them get these gigs, things like that, just because I really loved music. As a matter of fact, I pitched them. The law school has a dance every year called the barrister’s ball.
And, uh, I pitched them to the committee, I was like, there’s this great band REM. They’re from Athens and they’re really, they’re starting to really blow up and we should have them for the ball. And I got out voted and they had like a cover band, you know, like a Motown cover band.
Oh, man, I bet they were kicking themselves. Well, yeah, well, a year later, they were kicking themselves, and then they were calling me, going, hey, Charles, can you get us other guest lists, Ferrari? no, I can’t.
Anyway, I guess my point being that it’s really about loving music. And so, when I finished law school, I didn’t know really that you could be a music lawyer. Uh, Burtis, I don’t think really knew that either.
He just started representing them, and the next thing you know, they had more and more business, and then he was, like, eventually fully, you know, pretty much full-time their lawyer. He also was teaching at the law school in the early years. We didn’t really know that that was a career path.
If I had been in LA or New York. I might have known that. But I just didn’t.
So I came out of law school. I got a regular law job, but I still spent a lot of my time, energy and money on music. I went to see music.
I had friends who were musicians, et cetera, et cetera. And eventually, you know, late 80s, I, uh, you know, I started realizing that, you know, there was entertainment lawyers and there was enough music business going on in Atlanta and Athens that I might be able to, uh, get in on that. And so I started learning about that, going to seminars, meeting people, and, and, you know, started holding myself out as an entertainment lawyer, representing bands, labels, publishers, various aspects of the music business, and that eventually led to managing bands, uh, which is what I have done for the last 30 plus years.
Um. It started with a couple of bands in New Orleans. Uh, because I never did lose my connection to New Orleans.
I kept uh, going back. Uh, to visit friends and that sort of thing, and then eventually, in the 90s, I got an apartment down there, and around that time is when I picked up my 1st management client. And then another, eventually, around the year 2000, I started managing the Blind Boys of Alabama gospel group.
Uh, and I am still, uh, managing them, uh, there’s a younger guy that is coming in now, Jeff Delia, who is taking that over from me, but it’s been a good 25 year run. And uh, and eventually ended up with a staff of 5 people and managing about 10 artists with the blind boys being the longest uh, running of those, but, um, it’s been great because I’ve never really lost that focus of music 1st and I have been able to make a living while. Uh, putting the art at the center of it, which is, you know, sort of the reason I didn’t pursue radio was because it just, it didn’t seem like I was going to be able to be, you know, creative in that.
In the commercial radio world. Uh, but I, I have been able to be creative, but also, to, you know, obviously this is a business, and so if you’re managing artists, the artists are the primary creators, you, you can help with some things, but your main job is to manage the franchise, so to speak. And, uh, so over the course of time, I’ve had a bunch of artists be nominated for and win Grammys and, you know, travel all over the world and, uh, play Albert Hall and Lincoln Center and uh, Carnegie Hall and all kinds of cool places, the Fillmore.
Uh, Monterey jazz festival, Montro Jazz festival, et cetera. So, you know, and I attribute, uh, I used to say when I was practicing like what I call regular law. Yeah.
He used to say, I have this head full of knowledge. I know all of these bands and songs and, uh, et cetera. That’s never gonna do me any good.
Uh, but in the end, it actually did do me some good. Uh, all of that. Musical knowledge and all of the things that I learn in college radio.
Uh, have actually been, uh, like a library, like an encyclopedia resource that I can call upon in my day job. Yeah. And a foundation, obviously.
Yes. And so that’s that’s been fantastic and I wouldn’t trade my college radio experience for anything. What a fantastic story and how you took that passion and were able to spin it into a lifelong career that just kept feeding that passion.
So what’s in your future? More travel, it sounds like. It’s been interesting to go to shows simply to hear music because, yeah.
One of the things about working in the music business is you’re just like, if you’re going to, 1st of all, 90% of the shows I went to, was either my clients or somebody, uh, you know, somebody I was working with or, you know, there was some business aspect for the reason I was going. I mean, luckily, I really love the music of all my clients. I love the, the music of the kind of world that they live in, going to see other acts in that world, mostly which these days is mostly under the Americana music umbrella.
Uh, that’s been wonderful, you know, to have that opportunity, but like I said, 90% of the time there was some business aspect. These days, I might go to a show just to see a show, and that, you know, just to see some music, and I have no agenda. I’m not evaluating anything.
I’m not trying to make anything happen. So that has been wonderful just to go to a show without any agenda, you know, music is still a big part of my life. I have more time now to listen uh, to Spotify. et cetera, and uh, much, uh, as much as, I didn’t like the way that Spotify starts feeding you music after you finished listening to whatever album you chose to listen to.
I have discovered some new music that way, and there’s a lot of good music out there, it’s just that you have to sift through a lot of music to find it. Well, that was going to be my next question, is what are you doing now to discover new music? So that’s good to hear that the algorithms are working in your favor somewhat.
Somewhat. Uh, you know, this gets back to the thing I mentioned at the very 1st, which is the radio station WREK. That station was so eclectic, and one of the problems with algorithms is, suppose you like a Bob Dylan record or something in that vein, they keep feeding you that, but that’s not the only music I like.
I might like the Clash too. And so I need to hear some music in that vein. Uh, so, one of the things about, you know, algorithms is it, it tends to narrow, it keeps you in a, in a silo, so to speak.
Whereas the great thing about college radio is it expands your musical palate. You hear a lot of different things, and uh, a lot of different styles of music. Uh, and so, you know, but but having said that, I have discovered new music, uh, through Spotify.
And of course, I still read, you know, these days it’s mostly online, but read about, uh, new music and and check that out that way, the, you know, it’s wonderful to have all the, history of recorded music at your fingertips. That was something we never had. All right, so let’s wrap it up.
My final question I usually ask everyone is, what do you have to tell the college radio DJs of today? Why is college radio still important? Well, I think all of the things I’ve mentioned is why it’s important.
I mean, I, don’t, I would never, I did not look at it, and I would not look at it as any sort of training for a job. It’s just more of what, uh, liberal arts education does, which is just expanding your horizons, you know, it teaches you a lot of things. Uh, and allows you to interact with different people.
Uh, both on and off the air, uh, and expand your your musical vocabulary, if that’s important to you. And of course, as was pointed out in the movies, there’s the news people and the sports people as well, those may be a little more career path oriented, uh, or could be if a person wanted to, but, uh, I still feel that college radio is important. I listen to college radio.
I listened to WTUL when I was in New Orleans last week. Uh, I listen to WWOZ as well, which is a community station. So to me, it’s important.
Uh, and also still fun as far as I know. Uh, maybe not uh, as unregulated as we were, but I, I think there’s still a lot of positives for the DJ, or the person involved with the radio station, whatever capacity, uh, as well as the community. There’s a lot to be gained by both the individual and the community.
Well, this has been great. Thank you so much. Thanks, Lisa, and thanks, Charles, for joining us on the podcast.
Once again, 35,000 watts. The story of college radio is available to go watch right now on pretty much any of your favorite platforms. Amazon Prime, Google Play, Tubi, and now available on YouTube as well.
So, we’d love it if you went and check that out, and be sure and tune in for 120 months, our other podcast, where we talk about all kinds of indie music and college radio music, and come back for our next interview right here on 35,000 Watts, the podcast.